[kgr]

(Also posted on rgb)

Not having a real convention with my partner after 1NT-(2x) I want to start using Lebensohl or Rubensol (or anything else?).
Which of these 2 conventions is considered the best nowadays?
The points that are important for me are:
1. The convention should give you the best possibilities to show your hand.
2. Easy (this is for my partner
3. Able to use the same (similar) convention in other bidding situations. (I've seen that the Lebensohl 2NT is also used to solve other bidding problems)... What are your agreements?

Thanks

[Fluffy]

Nowadays I am using both lebenshol and rubenshol on different situations, their main difference is when opponents bid before you could show all your hand, lebenshol lets you show your strenght on first round while rubenshol lets you show your long suit, which one is the most important? it depends on the situations, here are my positions:

Lebenshol ones:
1NT-(2x)-2NT = lebenshol (weak with a suit), 3y=nat forcing, 3x= stayman.
(1x)-X-(2x)-2NT= lebenshol (weak with a suit), 3y=nat positive, 3x= GF.
(2x weak)-X-pass-2NT= lebenshol (weak with a suit), 3y=nat positive, 3x= GF.
1♣-(p)-1♠-(p)-2♥-(p)-2NT =lebenshol or 'moderateur', showing weak hands, rest are game forcing.

Rubenshol ones:

1x-(2♥/♠)-3y= rubenshol (opponents overcall must be natural), transfer to partner´s suit is a weak raise, while trtansfer to opponent´s suit is a limit+ raise.

(2x weak)-2NT(16-18)-(p)-3y = rubenshol, transfer to opponent´s suit is stayman.

[Free]

I use a mix of Rubensohl AND Lebensohl. Basicly, 2NT is Lebensohl, 3X = Rubensohl. This way we can make a difference between game-invitational bids and GF bids, we can use transfers to rightside the contract, ask about 4 card Majors,... I haven't had problems with it.

If you want to keep it as simple as possible, just play Rubensohl. Imo it's better than Lebensohl, but some people won't agree with me.

[Gerben47]

I play the same as free. It's called Rumpelsohl. The only English description I've found on the web is:
http://www.bridgeguy...anSheinwold.pdf

I'll change that.

Gerben

[kgr]

Thanks for replies till now!!

Quote

The only English description

Gerben,

Any Dutch description would even be better (Then I don't have to translate it for my partner)

Now I'll start to study:
- standard Lebensohl
- standard Rubensohl
(probably good to know them to play on internet and to better understand Rumpelsohl
)
- Rumpelsohl
(I'll be able to find them on internet via google, but if you have good references then you can let me know - would save me the time to query over the Google results)
... and probably more questions later.

[Free]

I forgot to mention that against 1NT-(2♣)-? and 1NT-(2♦)-? we use a special defense on 2-level. It depends on what these bids mean, and usually we use pass as forcing for 1 round. Nobody plays 2m undoubled at our table after a 1NT opening

Some people play multi-landy, other capp, other natural or DONT, and you need different defenses against these bids. However, 2NT+ bids usually are lebensohl-rubensohl, except against landy-2♣ and capp-2♦, there 2NT means 44+m and weak It's a real battle for partscores...

[pclayton]

Like the others, we play Rubensohl when our 1N (be it weak or strong) is overcalled at the 2 level. Lebensohl applies not only when we double a weak 2, but also in the auctions: (1 major) - pass - (2 major) - dbl - (pass) - ? and another useful circumstance: 1N (weak) - pass - (2 of anything) - dbl - (pass) - ?.

I used to play with a guy in Montana that played "Jacobysohl", which as I remember was like Rubensohl, but opener accepted the transfer every time, since the call didn't promise any values. The Rubensohl 2N call covers these situations, so a transfer at the 3 level promises invitational or better values - and Opener can be more flexible in the rebid.

I know of no one that plays Rubensohl in the auctions cited above where we play Lebensohl, although we've played around with the idea.

[kgr]

...I looked at Lebensohl, Rubinsohl (not Rubensohl apparently) and Rumpelsohl.
And yes: Rumpelsohl looks great.

Questions if playing Rumpelsohl (or Lebensohl) and strong NT:
Question1:
After 1NT-(2♣ ; natural):
You have:

---

Now you should bid:
1NT-(2♣)-2NT-
3♣-4♣
(Staymen with stopper in X).
It does not look very good to go above 3NT?

Question2:
Any reason why:
1NT-(2X)-3NT- denies stopper
1NT-(2X)-2NT-3♣-3NT promises stopper
... and not the other way around?

Question 3 (Rumpelsohl):
After 1NT-(2♣ ; natural):
You have:

---

Now you should bid:
1NT-(2♣)-2NT
(Staymen without stopper in X)?

... OR (Question 1 and 3) if you play Rumpelsohl then
1NT-(2♣; natural)-DBL: You can't play this DBL as penalty; This is always stayman
and:
1NT-(2♣; natural)-DBL-2♦-3NT: Stayman with stopper
1NT-(2♣; natural)-DBL-2♦-3♣: Stayman without stopper
??

[Free]

1) this bidding doesn't exist, since opps will bid 4♣ right away imo. And if it would happen, just Dbl for penalties. You're outbid anyway.

2) i don't know for sure, but I guess it's because with a stop you have time, without a stop (p probably has one) you don't want to penalty-dbl enough if they bid at 3-level...

3) this is the exact reason why I play different continuations after intervention of 2m. After 2♣ nat, I use Dbl as Stayman (and Pass is Forcing for 1 round). After 2♦ intervention we use pass (also Forcing for 1 round) or Dbl (4-4M) as stayman. This gives us much more opportunities to find partscores and games.

[luke warm]

1) i'd bid 2nt then 3nt over 3C

2) no reason at all, can play slow shows or slow denies

3) i'd bid 3nt over the 2C

all depending on scoring and vulnerability

[kgr]

Free,

- I think you misunderstood 1st question. Only 2♣ bid (between brackets) is by opponents... but you answered it in the 3rd question.
- Ok for your answer to question 3, only it's making it more difficult to remember. (certainly considering that natural overcalls over strong 1NT don't happen a lot).

Luke,

You will give up to find a fit in ♥... also without stop in ♣?
I'm afraid that I don't like that.

Koen

[kgr]

...and one more question Free:
After 1NT-(2♣)-pas
What will opener bid? DBL most of the time?
(I don't like to give up the penalty DBL and to encourage opps to intervene with 2♣)

Also in description of Lebensohl, Rubinsohl an Rumpelsohl I have found that DBL after two level overcall is take out. Therefor it is saver to intervene with a 3-level overcall than with a 2-level overcall? 1NT bidder and his partner will not be able to DBL for penalties?

[Free]

Yes, usually opener will usually Dbl after a forcing pass. Then responder can bid what he wants (also ♦s) or pass with a penalty Dbl.

Btw, natural overcalls are VERY frequent. For example, we consider DONT as natural (4+ card). Over here lots of people play natural or DONT vs 1NT, however, if you're in a cappeletti-land it won't be frequent.

It's not that difficult to remember imo:

1NT-(2♣)-?

Pass = Forcing for 1 round, 0+HCP
Dbl = Stayman
2♦ = trf ♥
2♥ = trf ♠
2♠ = inv, asks stop (trf ♣ has no use)
2NT = 4-4m weak
3♣+ = like they didn't bid

1NT-(2♦)-?

Pass = Forcing for 1 round, 0+HCP
Dbl = 4-4M
2M = weak to play (can be 4 card when short in OM)
2NT = Lebensohl
3♣+ = Rubensohl