[lmilne]

You are down to KQT98 after ruffing the 2nd round of diamonds, and LHO has AJxx.

After playing King, ducked, it's QT98 vs. AJx.
Now queen, he wins ace, T98 vs. Jx.
He leads another diamond, you ruff, T9 vs Jx.
Now ten, he wins jack and forces your last trump leaving himself with trump control.

[shyams]

I think this is very tough for a B/I problem. And I think (hidden)

Spoiler

1. The solution is counter-intuitive. Unless one has worked this out in advance, or spends a long time at the table, most will get it wrong
2. I play low spade at trick 3.
- If West wins with the ♠J immediately, he cannot force me in diamonds (dummy still has a trump)
- If West ducks, then I need to switch tacks and play ♠K! LHO will win and force us in diamonds. We ruff, play ♠Q and then play on hearts. West is only left with a winning ♠J which I'm happy for him to take at any time.

[vuroth]

lmilne, on Aug 10 2010, 08:37 AM, said:

You are down to KQT98 after ruffing the 2nd round of diamonds, and LHO has AJxx.

Dangit I already ruffed a ♦. Thank you - that's what I was missing.

[pooltuna]

shyams, on Aug 10 2010, 08:41 AM, said:

I think this is very tough for a B/I problem. And I think (hidden)

Spoiler

1. The solution is counter-intuitive. Unless one has worked this out in advance, or spends a long time at the table, most will get it wrong
2. I play low spade at trick 3.
- If West wins with the ♠J immediately, he cannot force me in diamonds (dummy still has a trump)
- If West ducks, then I need to switch tacks and play ♠K! LHO will win and force us in diamonds. We ruff, play ♠Q and then play on hearts. West is only left with a winning ♠J which I'm happy for him to take at any time.

B*I*N*G*O

[lmilne]

yeah, i think the counterintuitive thing is that it's hard to imagine LHO ducking, despite it being an easy play to make.

[pooltuna]

lmilne, on Aug 10 2010, 08:48 AM, said:

yeah, i think the counterintuitive thing is that it's hard to imagine LHO ducking, despite it being an easy play to make.

did you mean...

Spoiler

ducking the ♠K or ducking the small ♠ at trick 3?

[cherdanno]

Here is a related lesson that B/I's should take away from this hand. If you are defender with Axxx (or AHxx) of trumps, dummy has xx of trumps, then most of the time it is right to duck the first round of trumps (and almost always when you are trying to force declarer).

Once this has become automatic for you, I think it becomes easier to find the right line as declarer on this hand.

[vuroth]

For me, the hard problem on all of these problems seems to be visualizing that certain cards have already been played. I fall down on that time and time again.

So run the T♠. If LHO ducks and both follow, run ♥s. If/When LHO ruffs in, he can exit a ♦, but you ruff in dummy, cross in ♣s to your hand (safe from the bidding), and play the K♠ - he's not winning his J♠. If he exits a ♣, you win in hand, draw his trump, and you can still get to dummy in ♥s.

If LHO covers the T♠, he can't tap you in ♦s, which was the fear.

[vuroth]

cherdanno, on Aug 10 2010, 09:00 AM, said:

Here is a related lesson that B/I's should take away from this hand. If you are defender with Axxx (or AHxx) of trumps, dummy has xx of trumps, then most of the time it is right to duck the first round of trumps (and almost always when you are trying to force declarer).

Once this has become automatic for you, I think it becomes easier to find the right line as declarer on this hand.

Ok but if dummy has xxx, it's still right to duck. Heck, if dummy has xxxx, it's still right to duck, right?

I'm picturing us as LHO, but I can't see why it isn't just as obvious if we're RHO.

[vuroth]

Unbelievable. This is not the first time I've spun my wheels for hours on a problem because I forgot I'd already played a card out of my hand.

There's something really wrong with my visualization. I'm making things harder on myself than they need to be.

I agree that this is a very hard problem for N/B, whose first instinct will be to cross to dummy to finesse in ♠s. I actually don't think this is too much for Intermediates as a play problem, though, yes, they probably get it wrong at the table.

Obviously, this says something about my own current level.

As always, thanks Trumpace. I enjoy these problems.

[dustinst22]

shyams, on Aug 10 2010, 08:41 AM, said:

I think this is very tough for a B/I problem. And I think (hidden)

Spoiler

1. The solution is counter-intuitive. Unless one has worked this out in advance, or spends a long time at the table, most will get it wrong
2. I play low spade at trick 3.
- If West wins with the ♠J immediately, he cannot force me in diamonds (dummy still has a trump)
- If West ducks, then I need to switch tacks and play ♠K! LHO will win and force us in diamonds. We ruff, play ♠Q and then play on hearts. West is only left with a winning ♠J which I'm happy for him to take at any time.

This solution loses if East has J♠ with West having Axxx, correct?

[pooltuna]

dustinst22, on Aug 10 2010, 12:17 PM, said:

shyams, on Aug 10 2010, 08:41 AM, said:

I think this is very tough for a B/I problem. And I think (hidden)

Spoiler

1. The solution is counter-intuitive. Unless one has worked this out in advance, or spends a long time at the table, most will get it wrong
2. I play low spade at trick 3.
- If West wins with the ♠J immediately, he cannot force me in diamonds (dummy still has a trump)
- If West ducks, then I need to switch tacks and play ♠K! LHO will win and force us in diamonds. We ruff, play ♠Q and then play on hearts. West is only left with a winning ♠J which I'm happy for him to take at any time.

This solution loses if East has J♠ with West having Axxx, correct?

why do you think it loses? What 4 tricks is the defense going to take?

[dustinst22]

pooltuna, on Aug 10 2010, 12:21 PM, said:

dustinst22, on Aug 10 2010, 12:17 PM, said:

shyams, on Aug 10 2010, 08:41 AM, said:

I think this is very tough for a B/I problem. And I think (hidden)

Spoiler

1. The solution is counter-intuitive. Unless one has worked this out in advance, or spends a long time at the table, most will get it wrong
2. I play low spade at trick 3.
- If West wins with the ♠J immediately, he cannot force me in diamonds (dummy still has a trump)
- If West ducks, then I need to switch tacks and play ♠K! LHO will win and force us in diamonds. We ruff, play ♠Q and then play on hearts. West is only left with a winning ♠J which I'm happy for him to take at any time.

This solution loses if East has J♠ with West having Axxx, correct?

why do you think it loses? What 4 tricks is the defense going to take?

Sorry was thinking we'd be forced in dimes, but we still have a trump in dummy to avoid that problem.

[Mbodell]

This was a fun problem. I'm pretty sure I would have gotten it wrong at the table. I thought about it for a while last night and didn't see a solution (I kept trying to endplay West to give us an extra trump trick), but then this morning I had the eureka moment in the shower. It is weird how it is sometimes easier to solve the problem without looking at the cards.

[olliebol]

showering ionises your brain.

[Flameous]

Heh, I didn't bother to think this so much, just went on with my intuition and that was to ruff the diamond with middle trump and play small to the seven. Seems my intuition was right, but might be that without that disturbing 7 in the dummy I wouldn't find the right play

[billw55]

Nice problem!

As I improve, I am impressed by how often it is correct to duck the first round of a suit, even in strange situations where it wouldn't occur to me. A great technique to have in the toolbox.

[NickRW]

vuroth, on Aug 10 2010, 02:09 PM, said:

There's something really wrong with my visualization. I'm making things harder on myself than they need to be.

Heh, you have trouble with visualisation. Sometimes I miscount. A couple of weeks back I thought the trumps had split worse than they did and I was busily reducing my trumps like crazy - only to realise they had one less trump than I thought! Fortunately nothing bad happened and the contract still rolled in.