[kfay]

I'm sure this has been addressed before. But I'm too lazy to look.

Playing a forcing NT are the following sequences forcing or not?

1M-1N; 2X-2N; 3X : M > X

1M-1N; 2M-2N; 3m

[han]

I prefer 1M - 1NT - 2m - 2NT - 3m is non-forcing, 1S - 1NT - 2H - 2NT - 3H is forcing and 1M - 1NT - 2M - 2NT - 3m is forcing and typically a fragment.

[Phil]

I like 1M - 1N - 2x - 2N - 3x as nf and 3y as forcing. I cannot see any other way to play it; why would responder have to suffer in a 2N contract opposite a weak 5-5?

The 'work-around' to a strong 5-5 is for opener to bid a doubleton on a 5512 or a 5530. Responder can show 3 card preference for opener's 2nd suit, so I do not know what you gain by making 3x ever forcing.

[straube]

I think most play both as nf.

I like that 1S-1N, 2C-2N, 3C be non-minimum but that is not standard.

I think the following are widely played...

1S-1N, 2D-2N, 3C shows 3+C and can be raised. This sequence is stronger than 1H-1N, 2D-2N, 3C but not as strong as 1S-1N, 2H-2N, 3D.

1S-1N, 2C-2N, 3H shows probably 5314 and is intended as forcing.

1S-1N, 2S-2N, 3C is weaker than 1S-1N, 2C-2N, 3S. The latter is forcing.

1S-1N, 2H-2N, 3H is forcing because it needs to be but also because opener
is only showing one more card and needs compensating values.

[fromageGB]

1M-1N; 2X-2N; 3X : M > X
Non-forcing, even if X = ♥, though there is a case for this instance being forcing.

1M-1N; 2M-2N; 3m
Non-forcing. Both hands are limited, so I don't see 5m as a common enough contact to make this forcing. It does suggest a very unbalanced weakish hand, to me.

[kfay]

As a follow-up, how would you bid this hand that I held recently?

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[gwnn]

2♦ and 3♥ over 2N if you play it as forcing. if you play it as non forcing perhaps 4♥.

here's a thread that doesn't cover your second auction directly but why not link to old threads, I haven't done it in a while:

http://www.bridgebas.../31492-2nt-poll

[straube]

kfay, on 2010-December-06, 02:42, said:

As a follow-up, how would you bid this hand that I held recently?

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2H. If I rebid 2D, then I wouldn't feel quite worth a 3H bid after a 2H correction. If my rebid is 2H, I will attract a raise with some hands that would have otherwise corrected to 2H.

[Fluffy]

I bid 2♥, when partner bids 2NT its tempting to bid 4♥, dont like to play 3♦, but maybe 4♦ is an option.

[mikeh]

Not exactly on point, but maybe of some interest to some people: after 1Major 1N 2x, where x is not clubs, and is lower than the major (so 2♥/2♦ after 1♠ and 2♦ after 1♥), play transfers over the invitational 2N.

Thus with AQJxx AJxxx Kx x, where one is accepting the game invite, one can transfer to 3♥ then bid 3N, while with AJ10xx AQxxx xx x, one transfers to 3♥ and passes

And the same applies if the 2nd suit is a minor

With 6=4, in standard one chooses to bid 6, 6 and 4 with weak hands and, traditionally, 6, 4 and 6 with good hands. This works ok, but once in while one never gets to bid the 4 card suit because partner passes the rebid of the major, and one may play 2♥ on a 6-0 or 6-1 with a 9+ fit in the minor. This isn't a huge deal, but it still costs when it arises. Playing transfers increases the payoff from bidding 6, 4, 6 since over 2N, we can transfer back to the major with both weak and strong hands....passing the transfer response with the weak and bidding game with the strong....often 3N c o g, since partner will know we have 6=4 and can act accordingly.

The one downside is that you have problems with weak 0=5=4=4 and 5=0=4=4, since in order to show clubs over 2N, one has to bid 3♠.

You can deal with this to some degree by bidding Major, diamonds and clubs with good hands and Major, clubs and then transfer to diamonds with weak hands. In addition, when you hold 0=5=4=4, the odds are that the auction won't arise...the opps hold 10+ spades and some hcp.

With the final example hand, you can always show 6=4 by 1♥/2♦/3♦ transfer....the problem then is to decide whether to pass....but in the meantime, if you hit a home run in diamonds, you'll be happy you didn't have to wrestle with the 2♦ or 2♥ question.

[Free]

Both seem NF to me. With a 6-4 you'll rebid the Major immediately when minimum, while you'll rebid your second suit first when max. 1M-1NT-2m-2NT-3M would be forcing. Not sure what 1♠-1NT-2♥-2NT-3♥ should be...

[whereagles]

Usually these show weakish, distributional hands that prefer to try for a suit contract.

USUALLY.

[MrAce]

kfay, on 2010-December-06, 02:42, said:

As a follow-up, how would you bid this hand that I held recently?

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I bid 2♥ with this, i am not worried about 2 NT reply. What worries me is to play 4-3 ♦ J432 vs K86 instead of AKT9xx vs void. I prefer the AKT9xx as trump.

For your first question, i play them both NF.

mikeh, on 2010-December-06, 10:42, said:

Not exactly on point, but maybe of some interest to some people: after 1Major 1N 2x, where x is not clubs, and is lower than the major (so 2♥/2♦ after 1♠ and 2♦ after 1♥), play transfers over the invitational 2N.

Thus with AQJxx AJxxx Kx x, where one is accepting the game invite, one can transfer to 3♥ then bid 3N, while with AJ10xx AQxxx xx x, one transfers to 3♥ and passes

And the same applies if the 2nd suit is a minor

With 6=4, in standard one chooses to bid 6, 6 and 4 with weak hands and, traditionally, 6, 4 and 6 with good hands. This works ok, but once in while one never gets to bid the 4 card suit because partner passes the rebid of the major, and one may play 2♥ on a 6-0 or 6-1 with a 9+ fit in the minor. This isn't a huge deal, but it still costs when it arises. Playing transfers increases the payoff from bidding 6, 4, 6 since over 2N, we can transfer back to the major with both weak and strong hands....passing the transfer response with the weak and bidding game with the strong....often 3N c o g, since partner will know we have 6=4 and can act accordingly.

The one downside is that you have problems with weak 0=5=4=4 and 5=0=4=4, since in order to show clubs over 2N, one has to bid 3♠.

You can deal with this to some degree by bidding Major, diamonds and clubs with good hands and Major, clubs and then transfer to diamonds with weak hands. In addition, when you hold 0=5=4=4, the odds are that the auction won't arise...the opps hold 10+ spades and some hcp.

With the final example hand, you can always show 6=4 by 1♥/2♦/3♦ transfer....the problem then is to decide whether to pass....but in the meantime, if you hit a home run in diamonds, you'll be happy you didn't have to wrestle with the 2♦ or 2♥ question.

I loved this, thanks.

[lexlogan]

kfay, on 2010-December-06, 02:42, said:

As a follow-up, how would you bid this hand that I held recently?

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My hand could be worse but the misfit for spades is discouraging. I'll rebid 2♥ to limit my hand and follow with 3♦ if partner continues with 2NT.

[whereagles]

Agree that the hand should probably devaluate due to the spade void.

I would however bid 2♦, on grounds that if pard gives preference to hearts, I can make one final shot at game with 3♥.

Note 1: this probably wouldn't be acceptable in a style with showing diamonds with a 6-4 shows extras.

Note 2: bidding diamonds shows 9 red cards. Rebidding hearts would show only 6 red cards. Thus, if pard happens to bid 2♠ over 2♦, you can pretty much bet this is a misfit.