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Ruling in a European junior competition Somewhere in Europe!

#21 User is offline   gwnn 

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Posted 2011-February-23, 07:42

At the risk of repeating myself and other posts: was 2NT in fact game forcing? I see no clue in the opening post or thereafter.

At the risk of being off-topic: there is a difference between sequences like
1NT-2NT
3NT

1♥-2♥
3♥-4♥ (where 3♥ was just a range ask)

and

1♣-1♥
2NT-3NT (2NT 18-19)

In the first two sequences opps will have barely more than game values. In "points" it would mean something like 24-26 (with adjustments). They have a firm upper limit. In the third sequence opps might have up to 30 points, they just told us they were not interested in slam.

It is smart to double for speculative reasons in auctions of the first type. It is rarely indicated to do so in the latter type.
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#22 User is offline   Free 

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Posted 2011-February-23, 07:53

Keep the money, West has no argument to go in appeal except bad bridge from himself. Result stands.
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#23 User is offline   Jeremy69A 

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Posted 2011-February-23, 11:08

Has anyone considered taking a deposit from the first appeal committee who seem to have talked some awful rubbish?
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#24 User is offline   gnasher 

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Posted 2011-February-24, 09:05

Why can't the second committee overrule the first committee's decision to return the deposit?

If there were two deposits, I agree that the second one should be returned.
... that would still not be conclusive proof, before someone wants to explain that to me as well as if I was a 5 year-old. - gwnn
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#25 User is offline   aguahombre 

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Posted 2011-February-24, 11:06

"You are the AC [second AC! :rolleyes: ]. What do you think?"

I thought we had already established that this forum was meant when the OP referred to a second AC.
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#26 User is offline   AlexJonson 

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Posted 2011-February-26, 18:27

I think when you make a reasonable attempt at a good score and fail, you move on to the next board.

Appellant(s) here have more energy than I could muster to waste everyone's time.

Keeping their deposit would be understandable.
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#27 User is offline   nige1 

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Posted 2011-March-21, 20:59

In their ruling, the AC wrote that this 2N was GF but not alertable. IMO, a GF 2N rebid should be alertable. If, instead, it had been an ordinary limit-bid, then, IMO, a speculative double would be reasonable. The doubler judged that a spade lead might help to beat a marginal game.
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#28 User is offline   blackshoe 

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Posted 2011-March-22, 17:42

I'm sorry, Nigel, but as far as this ruling is concerned, whether 2NT should be alertable is irrelevant. Or are you saying that your reading of the regulations is that the bid is alertable?
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#29 User is offline   nige1 

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Posted 2011-March-22, 18:59

View Postblackshoe, on 2011-March-22, 17:42, said:

I'm sorry, Nigel, but as far as this ruling is concerned, whether 2NT should be alertable is irrelevant. Or are you saying that your reading of the regulations is that the bid is alertable?
IMO the alertability of 2N is relevant. I think a call (even a natural call) should be alerted if is game-forcing, when opponents wouldn't even expect it to be forcing.
Frances Hinden informs us that, under EBL regulations, this 2N bid is not alertable. So I got it wrong :(
I've learnt something. Thank you Frances :)
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#30 User is offline   blackshoe 

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Posted 2011-March-22, 19:53

If the regulation says the bid is not alertable, then it's not alertable, and you can't base a ruling on your opinion that it should be. That's all I'm saying.
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I have come to realise it is futile to expect or hope a regular club game will be run in accordance with the laws. -- Jillybean
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#31 User is offline   nige1 

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Posted 2011-March-23, 20:32

View Postblackshoe, on 2011-March-22, 19:53, said:

If the regulation says the bid is not alertable, then it's not alertable, and you can't base a ruling on your opinion that it should be. That's all I'm saying.
Fair enough. I got the law wrong. Sorry.
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#32 User is offline   ggwhiz 

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Posted 2011-March-24, 09:57

West has more reason to double if he thinks the 3nt bid was forced rather than volunteered over an invite by a hand that could be much stronger. Alertable or not, there is less than zero damage.

Even then, it's a wild gamble and I'm keeping the money. OK, 1/2 the money in sympathy to East.
When a deaf person goes to court is it still called a hearing?
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