[thepossum]

pilowsky, on 2021-January-03, 23:57, said:

I don't like it much either, although 2♣ does seem to mean forcing for at least one round in most situations.
What do you suggest as an alternative? There seems to be an entrenched dislike for Benjamin two's. What does one open with hands that look like these?:

• K&R (AK983 AJT43 A2 A) = 24.45 DK 22- or
• K&R (AK983 A9843 A2 A) = 23.20 DK = 20 or worse
• K&R (AK983 A9843 A2 2) = 19.80 DK = 16

These hands give newbies like me nightmares. Too big, wrong shape, very annoying.

I stopped using KR. I cant do it quickly in my head so its useless to me

I spent a while trying to compare my assessment of hands using simpler methods with KR. I even tried learning it to see if I could work it out in my head etc When I say simpler sometimes I don't even care about how many points

But as an aside, revisiting this thread after a while, it never ceases to amaze me how much of the discussion involves other meanings of 3NT other than one your partner bid

[pilowsky]

thepossum, on 2021-January-11, 18:10, said:

I stopped using KR. I cant do it quickly in my head so its useless to me

I spent a while trying to compare my assessment of hands using simpler methods with KR. I even tried learning it to see if I could work it out in my head etc When I say simpler sometimes I don't even care about how many points

But as an aside, revisiting this thread after a while, it never ceases to amaze me how much of the discussion involves other meanings of 3NT other than one your partner bid

I'm with you there.
Between counting winners, quick tricks, losers etc I'd never make an opening bid.
It at the moment I'm staring at <19% in today's daylong - I might have to start playing Snap. No doubt there's a Snap Forum where I can get my ideas corrected as well .
Amazing!! There actually is!

[thepossum]

pilowsky, on 2021-January-11, 19:53, said:

I'm with you there.
Between counting winners, quick tricks, losers etc I'd never make an opening bid.
It at the moment I'm staring at <19% in today's daylong - I might have to start playing Snap. No doubt there's a Snap Forum where I can get my ideas corrected as well .
Amazing!! There actually is!

Snap

[wuudturner]

As others have said, the answer was to not open 2♣ in the first place. (That was not one of the poll options.) A big reason for that is to foresee the bidding once you do that. Partner almost always bids 2♢. And then you need to rebid 3♢. This is possibly the most problematic bidding sequence that starts with 2♣, because it will often endplay partner into bidding 3NT, regardless of what they have.

Is it a good idea? No. If you open 2♣ on 19 point hands because you like your hand without thinking about how the bidding will go, then you get what you should deserve - a random result.

If partner has enough to respond to 1♢, then you will be happy. And you will have one heck of a better chance to get to a reasonable contract.

Others have said the same thing as I have. But I did not see the point made to about ALWAYS consider what will be your most probable rebid in any auction, before you start bidding. And if you don't like what you see, then consider if another bid may be a better choice.