[jillybean]

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I think I need to tell partner that we have game. To do this I need to bid 2♣*
Partner rebids spades, showing 6+, now I get to describe my hand as a GF 2 suiter. ©DavidKok
Yes there is a discrepancy in suit quality between hand 1 and this hand but I don't see how the methods used would differ.

[smerriman]

For reference:

2♥ or 2♠? (Currently 62% 2♥)
3♣ or 3♥? (Currently 60% 3♣ and 30% 3♥ (with 3 votes for 2N)).

Not that the majority decision in any poll is necessarily the right one, but definitely a couple of tricky decisions in this hand.

[bluenikki]

jillybean, on 2023-June-02, 15:24, said:

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I think I need to tell partner that we have game. To do this I need to bid 2♣*
Partner rebids spades, showing 6+, now I get to describe my hand as a GF 2 suiter. ©DavidKok
Yes there is a discrepancy in suit quality between hand 1 and this hand but I don't see how the methods used would differ.

With the original hand, the only game might be 5♣ on a 6-1 fit. Showing the poor hearts won't get you there.

With the hypothetical, the only game might be 4♥ on a 4-3 fit. How will you get there if the 3♥ is not taken as suggesting a possible strain?

Or is it your point that _because_ 2/1 is not quite GF, you can't describe this hand. I certainly agree with that!

[DavidKok]

No, the point is that even with 2♣ 100% GF, natural continuations simply aren't sophisticated enough to solve all these issues. We might belong in 3NT, we might belong in 4♥ or 4♠ or even in slam or 5♣. Showing your shape is almost always the best way to get to a good contract - at the very least you won't regularly miss 8 card major suit fits. Using different routes to describe the same shape based on suit quality is nice but places a lot of strain on the system, and doing so in anticipation of a good 7-card fit is masterminding.
If your system is good enough to have two sequences to show 4♥5(+)♣ but with different suit qualities for each I would take the route that best matches the example hand. I know for a fact that my continuations over 1♠-2♣ are not, so I'll just bid my suits one at a time and hope partner can do something intelligent.

[bluenikki]

"Using different routes to describe the same shape based on suit quality is nice but places a lot of strain on the system, and doing so in anticipation of a good 7-card fit is masterminding."

I would have said that EXCLUDING 7-card fits is masterminding.