[kfay]

Scoring: IMP

1♦-(2♦)-?

---

[jillybean]

ignore this

[aguahombre]

jillybean, on Aug 21 2010, 11:07 AM, said:

ignore this

That is my choice too ..

Second choice, I guess is to double. If pard doesn't double 2S, I try 3C. The problem with passing is CHO, who will know neither my strength nor my dislike of diamonds. If pard bids 3D anyway, either immediately or after my next call, he will do so knowingly.

This post has been edited by aguahombre: 2010-August-21, 11:20

[jkdood]

Just curious: what would 2N mean now?

[aguahombre]

jkdood, on Aug 22 2010, 12:00 AM, said:

Just curious: what would 2N mean now?

unusual...two lower unbid, like that hand

[jkdood]

aguahombre, on Aug 22 2010, 01:07 AM, said:

jkdood, on Aug 22 2010, 12:00 AM, said:

Just curious: what would 2N mean now?

unusual...two lower unbid, like that hand

Methods here are seemingly relevant.
3C would presumably be natural non-forcing (since 2H is available,) and seems to have merit -
although if 2N was good-bad or Leb and relayed to 3C, maybe even better.

[karlson]

I would just pass.

[effervesce]

I'd X. The hand looks like it may be a misfit.

[pooltuna]

Double for me. Shouldn't this show an interest in whacking at least one of the majors when they bid it?

[MFA]

Very annoying. We can anticipate a preference to spades by LHO. If we double now and it goes 2♠-p-p, we are in deep trouble because partner's pass is forcing. At least as I play it. So I think double now is out. For those who might not play X as promising another bid after a simple preference: Do you combine this with subsequent penalty doubles or takeout doubles?

I see two options. Pass and then pass. Or pass and then X takeout. I try the former and hope we are not being robbed. It smells like a misfit.

[aguahombre]

Jkdood: sorry about bad joke in response to serious question.

If :
2H=clubs and strong (GF)
2S=diamond support and L.R.+
3C=NF
3D=stretch support
double=start of cooperation about defending or just plain wanting to defend.

then:
What we (per advance discussion) have left for 2NT is game forcing minor 2-suiter (fit plus clubs here).

On this hand, double is fine because if partner passes 2S, she will have ---by inference --- club tolerance.

[P_Marlowe]

I guess, it is either pass or 3C, assuming 3C could be that weak,
but I guess not, so it is pass.

With kind regards
Marlowe

[Phil]

MFA, on Aug 22 2010, 08:05 AM, said:

Very annoying.

This sums up my feelings but my concern would be that if I x and then bid 3♣ that it would be forcing.

I think I'll pass. The chances of them landing in hearts is unlikely, but if I double, LHO can pass with equal length and if RHO has longer spades, my double helps them find that.

If it continues 2♠ - p - p, 3♣ looks like the right move. I generally play pass and then double as 'card showing' and more balanced but I confess that I really don't have a clue about these auctions and wish there was more of a standard.

[aguahombre]

Phil, on Aug 22 2010, 01:17 PM, said:

but my concern would be that if I x and then bid 3♣ that it would be forcing.

This would be a concern for me, too ---if I could find a hand which had forcing club values, wanted to waste time doubling first, and then didn't want to cue the suit I have (major) for notrump exploration.

Since I can't find a hand like that, double then 3C is not forcing for me. But like Dennis Miller, "It's just my opinion. I could be wrong."

[h2osmom]

Why is no one bidding 3c here non forcing?

[aguahombre]

because they don't have enough clubs.

[jkdood]

Thank you for serious explanations.

Still wondering if a good-bad Lebensol-like 2N, toplay/compete in either minor, (relay to 3C suggested) has much more merit on frequency than a strong dbl-fit (may be shown other ways.)

LHO may also have a x (of 3C or 3D), but won't be sure which minor you are headed for, so may simply bid 3s when theres trouble-a-double lurking.

[hanp]

I don't think double by 3C is forcing Phil, but that doesn't make it an attractive bid. It overstates both our clubs and our strength. I agree with those that said this is a very ugly hand, and I think I might pass twice as well.

I think 2NT is best play as both minors, at least 4 diamonds and 5 clubs. As 2H and 2S are available for good hands with clubs or diamonds and 3C and 3D are available for bad hands with clubs or diamonds, I don't see a use for good/bad 2NT.

[jkdood]

hanp, on Aug 23 2010, 02:21 AM, said:

...I don't see a use for good/bad 2NT.

I suggest it could differentiate between game interest (invitational) and just competitive.