[bucky]

Cyberyeti, on Sep 30 2010, 05:07 PM, said:

Exactly, this is not a forcing pass situation, you have no reason to suspect you're beating 5♣, or that you want to bid 5♥, defending 5♣ undoubled is perfectly plausible (give patrner AKQ5 and out or KQJ6).

I've never known something that might be a preempt trigger a forcing pass.

Yes, it doesn't work well when the person in 3rd seat decides to open 3♣ with some 18 counts...

[vuroth]

Sorry, you're right, I'd forgotten we were in 4th chair. If we were in 3rd chair, though, I would have said not forcing pass.

[jdonn]

bucky, on Sep 30 2010, 05:34 PM, said:

Cyberyeti, on Sep 30 2010, 05:07 PM, said:

Exactly, this is not a forcing pass situation, you have no reason to suspect you're beating 5♣, or that you want to bid 5♥, defending 5♣ undoubled is perfectly plausible (give patrner AKQ5 and out or KQJ6).

I've never known something that might be a preempt trigger a forcing pass.

Yes, it doesn't work well when the person in 3rd seat decides to open 3♣ with some 18 counts...

a - LOL
b - No one will open 3♣ on an 18 count, if they do they will stop after they miss 3NT a few times
c - Jumping to 4♥ over a preempt is not a preempt
d - A preempt can even trigger a forcing pass when we haven't shown game values or even bid game! For example it's common among experts to play P P 3♣ X 5♣ P is forcing.

[bucky]

vuroth, on Sep 30 2010, 05:38 PM, said:

Sorry, you're right, I'd forgotten we were in 4th chair. If we were in 3rd chair, though, I would have said not forcing pass.

I would totally agree: when the partner of preemptive bidder hasn't passed, forcing pass doesn't automatically apply.

[Phil]

jonottawa, on Sep 30 2010, 05:34 PM, said:

Wrong section. 100% forcing pass situation if in the right section. If playing with a beginner/intermediate it's a guess and I'd prolly bid 5♥. If partner later explained why he doubled for the right reasons, he gets a gold star (and an apology if I bid 5♥.)

LOL, I was thinking the same thing. How in the world did this morph into a FP discussion in the BI's?

[BunnyGo]

Phil, on Sep 30 2010, 06:18 PM, said:

jonottawa, on Sep 30 2010, 05:34 PM, said:

Wrong section.  100% forcing pass situation if in the right section.  If playing with a beginner/intermediate it's a guess and I'd prolly bid 5♥.  If partner later explained why he doubled for the right reasons, he gets a gold star (and an apology if I bid 5♥.)

LOL, I was thinking the same thing. How in the world did this morph into a FP discussion in the BI's?

Speaking of, how does one decide whether to post in B/I vs A/E? I'm never sure where to post my questions, so I usually default to B/I just because.

[kfay]

You're an advanced/expert player. So post in A/E.

[Fluffy]

BunnyGo, on Oct 1 2010, 12:19 AM, said:

Phil, on Sep 30 2010, 06:18 PM, said:

jonottawa, on Sep 30 2010, 05:34 PM, said:

Wrong section.  100% forcing pass situation if in the right section.  If playing with a beginner/intermediate it's a guess and I'd prolly bid 5♥.  If partner later explained why he doubled for the right reasons, he gets a gold star (and an apology if I bid 5♥.)

LOL, I was thinking the same thing. How in the world did this morph into a FP discussion in the BI's?

Speaking of, how does one decide whether to post in B/I vs A/E? I'm never sure where to post my questions, so I usually default to B/I just because.

I don't, so I post on interesting bridge hands instead lol.

It notmally works this way: you post in the B/I when you want to learn from other's explanations and help others with a constructive discussion. You post in A/E when you want insults, big egos, laugh a others, etc.

This is jsut the exception that confirms the rule

[pooltuna]

bucky, on Sep 30 2010, 12:11 AM, said:

BunnyGo, on Sep 29 2010, 11:52 PM, said:

Scoring: IMP

(P)-P-(3♣)-4♥
(5♣)-X-(P)-??

---

Do you agree with 4 hearts? What do you bid this time?

No, I call director. Maybe the other 3 players have 14 cards each.

the OP made one minor error and you are calling the director? the hand is really

♠KQ
♥AKJT4
♦KQ
♣1

You might want to check with Hanp for an interpretation

[pooltuna]

BunnyGo, on Sep 29 2010, 11:52 PM, said:

Scoring: IMP

(P)-P-(3♣)-4♥
(5♣)-X-(P)-??

---

Do you agree with 4 hearts? What do you bid this time?

yes 4♥ is right as partner needs 2 aces to make 6 and the 5 level is enough of a risk to warrant bypassing Blackwood(i.e. partner has no aces).

over 5♣X I think you can assume partner has an ace so 5♥is safe. If you elect to pass you need to set 5♣ for 800 at least 50% of the time which looks hard as I think 500 if much more likely. So bid 5♥

[bucky]

pooltuna, on Oct 1 2010, 09:41 AM, said:

the OP made one minor error and you are calling the director?

Check my follow-up posts. I uncalled the director.

[bucky]

pooltuna, on Oct 1 2010, 10:27 AM, said:

over 5♣X I think you can assume partner has an ace so 5♥is safe. If you elect to pass you need to set 5♣ for 800 at least 50% of the time which looks hard as I think 500 if much more likely. So bid 5♥

Why is 5♥ safe if partner has an ace? Don't you lose 2 tricks in side suits plus ♥Q?

[bucky]

P_Marlowe, on Sep 30 2010, 04:21 AM, said:

Hi,

#1 given that p is a passed hand, 4H is ok, otherwise I would go via X
#2 Now I pass

With kind regards
Marlowe

I disagree on the 2nd half of #1. Even if partner is unpassed hand, I see no alternative call to 4♥.

If I double first, I may not be well placed. Say partner bids 3♠. Now 4♥ by me doesn't show 8-card suit, instead it shows a strong flexible hand, typical shapes are 3541 / 3532 / 3631 etc.

I know 4♥ bid risks missing slam on some hands, but at least I'd get the strain right.