[pran]

barmar, on 2013-March-23, 00:57, said:

Furthermore, isn't the Acol bidding system named after a real bridge club in London, where the system originated?

The Acol system was introduced in Norway in a little book by Ranik Halle in 1951. There I found (my translation):

The English use their own system, Acol. Naturally there is a great interest in this system of the European champions from 1948 through 1950, but typical for the British temperament the literature on Acol is rather incomplete and scarcely codified. "Acol is more a question of style than a system" says M Harrison-Gray. None of the books say anything about the origin of the system, and only after much research have I succeeded in finding that the name comes from a small club in Hampstead in North West London, where among others this year's champion J.C.H.Marx and late S.J.Simon, champion in 1948 and 49 were members. These two, I assume, laid the foundation, apparently already in 1933. I have no idea whether the Acol club still exists.

[FrancesHinden]

pran, on 2013-March-23, 02:18, said:

The Acol system was introduced in Norway in a little book by Ranik Halle in 1951. There I found (my translation):

The English use their own system, Acol. Naturally there is a great interest in this system of the European champions from 1948 through 1950, but typical for the British temperament the literature on Acol is rather incomplete and scarcely codified. "Acol is more a question of style than a system" says M Harrison-Gray. None of the books say anything about the origin of the system, and only after much research have I succeeded in finding that the name comes from a small club in Hampstead in North West London, where among others this year's champion J.C.H.Marx and late S.J.Simon, champion in 1948 and 49 were members. These two, I assume, laid the foundation, apparently already in 1933. I have no idea whether the Acol club still exists.

The club was named after Acol Road.

[jandrew]

barmar, on 2013-March-23, 00:57, said:

Furthermore, isn't the Acol bidding system named after a real bridge club in London, where the system originated?

Yes, you are right.

Indeed the Acol Bridge Club was in Acol Road, London (hence its name); although it has since moved a couple of hundred yards.

[PeterAlan]

barmar, on 2013-March-23, 00:57, said:

Furthermore, isn't the Acol bidding system named after a real bridge club in London, where the system originated?

Acol was indeed named for the Acol Bridge Club (in its 1930s incarnation), which was in turn named for Acol Road, in which it was located, and which in its turn was apparently named for a small place in Kent.

Edit: this crossed with Frances' and jandrew's replies. To complete the picture, it seems the Acol place name derives from two Old English words, "ac" and "holt", meaning oak and wood.

[blackshoe]

Yes. It's called "The Acol Bridge Club", if I remember correctly. However, the name of neither the one in Acol Street nor the one on BBO is "Acol", the name of both is "The Acol Bridge Club".

[barmar]

blackshoe, on 2013-March-23, 07:56, said:

Yes. It's called "The Acol Bridge Club", if I remember correctly. However, the name of neither the one in Acol Street nor the one on BBO is "Acol", the name of both is "The Acol Bridge Club".

Wow, that's getting really finicky. By that logic, there are no states in the US named Massachusetts, Rhode Island, or Virginia.

[blackshoe]

Technically, Massachussets and Virginia are "Commonwealths". However, there's a difference between the two situations. One of the definitions of "commonwealth" is "a formal title of some of the states of the US". Rhode Island is "The State of Rhode Island and Providence Plantations" which is unique and the longest name of any of the states, but all fifty of the fifty states are states. "Acol" is the name of a street in London and the name of a bidding system. It is not the name of a bridge club, although I wouldn't be surprised if the one in Acol Street is referred to informally as "the Acol". The one on BBO is likely referred to informally as "BBO". But you're right, this is far afield, and we've probably exhausted any useful discussion about it.

[gnasher]

blackshoe, on 2013-March-26, 00:43, said:

we've probably exhausted any useful discussion about it.

Not quite. Is it OK if I nitpick your nitpick?

Quote

It is not the name of a bridge club, although I wouldn't be surprised if the one in Acol Street is referred to informally as "the Acol"

There is no street called "Acol Street" - it's Acol Road, as mentioned in the three posts that immediately preceded yours. And the Acol Bridge Club is now in West End Lane. But it is commonly referred to as "The Acol".

[WellSpyder]

blackshoe, on 2013-March-26, 00:43, said:

we've probably exhausted any useful discussion about it.

gnasher, on 2013-March-26, 03:41, said:

Not quite [....]

Depends on your definition of "useful"!

[billw55]

I nominate this thread for hijack of the year. lol

[blackshoe]

gnasher, on 2013-March-26, 03:41, said:

Not quite. Is it OK if I nitpick your nitpick?


There is no street called "Acol Street" - it's Acol Road, as mentioned in the three posts that immediately preceded yours. And the Acol Bridge Club is now in West End Lane. But it is commonly referred to as "The Acol".

What's the difference between a street and a road? But I suppose you can nitpick that if you like.

[jandrew]

billw55, on 2013-March-26, 06:18, said:

I nominate this thread for hijack of the year. lol

Perhaps you are right.

I was the TD at the tournament at which the OP played, and was aware of his alert and of his opp's enquiry thereon.

I wanted to join in the thread without getting into the argument.

The diversion which I joined, however, is now more appropriately described as a hijack.

I shall, therefore, be content if no hostages are taken .

[bluejak]

Cyberyeti, on 2013-March-21, 18:19, said:

No idea about BBO, EBU we don't technically have to tell people our weak 2s could be a 4 card suit and a yarborough in some positions as they are natural and weak but we do.

That's about to change. But certainly five card suits are not alertable.

aguahombre, on 2013-March-22, 01:22, said:

That is the point, exactly. If we have an agreement (implicit or explicit) to vary from the norm, then we disclose. Otherwise, what we actually made the bid with is not alertable. When we are self alerting, we alert what partner should have alerted IRL without screens.

Ooh, I don't think so. As with screens, you alert rather more, because there are no UI problems. Furthermore, you can put the explanation in straight away, can you not, without waiting to be asked?



It is a pity that people decide to mis-spell for no obvious reason. I suppose they are so used to SAYC and so on. But while the Acol system was named after the club which was named after the road, it is less clear that the road was named after the village in Kent, or that it has any connection.

[gnasher]

blackshoe, on 2013-March-26, 10:03, said:

What's the difference between a street and a road? But I suppose you can nitpick that if you like.

I've only just noticed this.

A street is usually in a town, and its primary function tends to be to provide access to the buildings on either side; a road's primary function tends to be to provide a route from one place to another. There are many exceptions to this rule, including Watling Street (an ancient Roman road) and Acol Road (a street in North London).

[mycroft]

I am now reminded of Former Ontario Highway 11a, otherwise known as Avenue Road.

[blackshoe]

gnasher, on 2013-April-18, 15:52, said:

I've only just noticed this.

A street is usually in a town, and its primary function tends to be to provide access to the buildings on either side; a road's primary function tends to be to provide a route from one place to another. There are many exceptions to this rule, including Watling Street (an ancient Roman road) and Acol Road (a street in North London).

Thanks, Andy. I had just looked them both up and then saw your post. Good to know.

Interesting aside: one of the things I stumbled over in David Weber's fantasy series about Bahzell Bahnakson, a Paladin of the war god Tomanak, was that every place where we would say "anyway", the characters say "any road". Took me a while to get it. :-)

[blackshoe]

bluejak, on 2013-April-18, 15:20, said:

Ooh, I don't think so. As with screens, you alert rather more, because there are no UI problems.

Is this one of those "custom and practice" things?

[bluejak]

With screens, no: you are told to be more forthcoming.

Online I suppose I am being optimistic because of all the people whose idea of fairness is limited or whose ignorance is great. But people who understand tend to alert more because they know the downside is less.

[mycroft]

I would add that there is an incentive to self-Alert and auto-explain playing online:

1NT-2♣!;
2♦!-2NT!
3♣!-3♦!
3NT

...and now comes the ask about what 3♣ means. "No 5cM, not any 4333".

Club lead from Txx sets the contract, of course. No, I have no idea which opponent asked.</sarcasm>