[lamford]

---

Nobody found the winning lead in the Bermuda Bowl today on this hand. The above was the auction in the Netherlands v England match, and was part of a run of England conceding 49 IMPs without reply. At other tables the opening bid varied from 3C to 5C, with East invariably going 5C if West did not. I was surprised by the choices of world-class players. If you know the hand, still comment.

[billw55]

I guess if the ♥K is obvious to me, I must not be an expert.

[jallerton]

This depends on the auction.

If RHO opens 5♣, I'll also lead ♥K, a better guess than any other suit.

On the auction shown in the diagram where LHO raises and partner doubles, I lead a trump. I expect partner to hold high cards in each pointed suit, so the opponents' main weapon will be trumps. If dummy has a doubleton trump, he rates to have a shortage outside. If trumps are 7-3, a trump lead at trick 1 followed by a second trump lead from partner when he gets in with one of his aces may be necessary to stop a second ruff in dummy.

[lamford]

jallerton, on 2013-September-21, 16:23, said:

This depends on the auction.

If RHO opens 5♣, I'll also lead ♥K, a better guess than any other suit.

On the auction shown in the diagram where LHO raises and partner doubles, I lead a trump. I expect partner to hold high cards in each pointed suit, so the opponents' main weapon will be trumps. If dummy has a doubleton trump, he rates to have a shortage outside. If trumps are 7-3, a trump lead at trick 1 followed by a second trump lead from partner when he gets in with one of his aces may be necessary to stop a second ruff in dummy.

A trump lead would indeed beat the contract, but there was a plethora of 5Cx, with only one declarer opening 5C. In the others (one can view the archive on Bridgebase), 3C or 4C was the most common opener, and a trump lead was marked but not found.

[dake50]

On the auction shown in the diagram where LHO raises and partner doubles, I lead a trump. I expect partner to hold high cards in each pointed suit, so the opponents' main weapon will be trumps. If dummy has a doubleton trump, he rates to have a shortage outside. If trumps are 7-3, a trump lead at trick 1 followed by a second trump lead from partner when he gets in with one of his aces may be necessary to stop a second ruff in dummy.

*** Nailed this one. Hard to imagine stopping ruffs is wrong, maybe second best.

[billw55]

lamford, on 2013-September-21, 16:53, said:

A trump lead would indeed beat the contract, but there was a plethora of 5Cx, with only one declarer opening 5C. In the others (one can view the archive on Bridgebase), 3C or 4C was the most common opener, and a trump lead was marked but not found.

How "marked" is it really, if nobody found it at the Bermuda Bowl?

Sure, jallerton's thinking sounds reasonable. But this is the BB, the best in the world, and nobody did it (if that information is correct). So I don't think it can be quite that simple.

[rhm]

billw55, on 2013-September-23, 06:55, said:

How "marked" is it really, if nobody found it at the Bermuda Bowl?

Sure, jallerton's thinking sounds reasonable. But this is the BB, the best in the world, and nobody did it (if that information is correct). So I don't think it can be quite that simple.

A trump lead is clearly indicated on the above auction

Rainer Herrmann

[billw55]

rhm, on 2013-September-23, 07:04, said:

A trump lead is clearly indicated on the above auction

Rainer Herrmann

OK. You are a much better player than I, as are most of the posters here.

Still, I am getting a slight feeling of forum hypocrisy here. Recently, several posters have (gently or otherwise) mocked PhilG007 for failing to recognize that many posters here are much better players than he, and that perhaps he should listen to them. I agree. But now in this thread, several posters seem to have decided they know better than all the players in the Bermuda Bowl. I know it isn't the same people, so maybe there is no relevance. It just struck me as a little ironic. Maybe I am way off, dunno.

[rhm]

billw55, on 2013-September-23, 07:11, said:

OK. You are a much better player than I, as are most of the posters here.

Still, I am getting a slight feeling of forum hypocrisy here. Recently, several posters have (gently or otherwise) mocked PhilG007 for failing to recognize that many posters here are much better players than he, and that perhaps he should listen to them. I agree. But now in this thread, several posters seem to have decided they know better than all the players in the Bermuda Bowl. I know it isn't the same people, so maybe there is no relevance. It just struck me as a little ironic. Maybe I am way off, dunno.

Just remind yourself who gets to the Bermuda Bowl is a great a player. But even great players are humans and Bridge is like any great game a game of mistakes and do not believe great players never make mistakes. On closer inspection they make a lot.
They make fewer mistakes than us, but do not believe they are perfect.

Rainer Herrmann

[billw55]

rhm, on 2013-September-23, 07:50, said:

Just remind yourself who gets to the Bermuda Bowl is a great a player. But even great players are humans and Bridge is like any great game a game of mistakes and do not believe great players never make mistakes. On closer inspection they make a lot.
They make fewer mistakes than us, but do not believe they are perfect.

Rainer Herrmann

Rainer, I understand, even the greatest players ever can and do make mistakes. This is a matter of record. Very rarely, a mistake occurs that even I could have avoided (although probably not in the state of fatigue that likely contributed).

What gets my attention here, is that all of them made the same mistake. I suspect this is much harder to find examples of - but maybe there is precedent.

[lamford]

billw55, on 2013-September-23, 07:11, said:

OK. You are a much better player than I, as are most of the posters here.

Still, I am getting a slight feeling of forum hypocrisy here. Recently, several posters have (gently or otherwise) mocked PhilG007 for failing to recognize that many posters here are much better players than he, and that perhaps he should listen to them. I agree. But now in this thread, several posters seem to have decided they know better than all the players in the Bermuda Bowl. I know it isn't the same people, so maybe there is no relevance. It just struck me as a little ironic. Maybe I am way off, dunno.

Sementa led the KH after the auction 4C-4H-6C-X. Declarer should now have been only 1 off. Bilski, against Versace, led the KH, after the auction 5C-P-P-P. Travis against Stockdale led the KH after the same auction as given here. Triple World Champion Sally Brock led the KH after the auction 3C-4H-5C-P-P-X-P-P-P, so that match was flat in 5Cx. dburn commented: looks as though North at the other table forgot the second important rule of opening leads - against sacrifices, lead trumps.

Bakhshi led the KH against the same auction as here. Previous BB winner Helness led KH after the auction 3C-3H-4C-X-P-4H-5C-X-P-P-P. Niemeijer led KH after the auction 1C-1H-X-XX-3C-3H-3NT-X-4C-P-5C-X-P-P-P. So, whenever 5C was reached by whatever route, the KH was led. Is is right to criticise the collective wisdom of these Bermuda Bowl or Venice Cup experts? I thought Mr Burn's comment was right, and all the Norths forgot Burn's second rule. (I would like to know the first, but suspect it is to cash the ace of trumps against a grand before partner can revoke).

[gnasher]

lamford, on 2013-September-23, 08:01, said:

Sementa led the KH after the auction 4C-4H-6C-X. Declarer should now have been only 1 off. Bilski, against Versace, led the KH, after the auction 5C-P-P-P. Travis against Stockdale led the KH after the same auction as given here. Triple World Champion Sally Brock led the KH after the auction 3C-4H-5C-P-P-X-P-P-P, so that match was flat in 5Cx. dburn commented: looks as though North at the other table forgot the second important rule of opening leads - against sacrifices, lead trumps.

Bakhshi led the KH against the same auction as here. Previous BB winner Helness led KH after the auction 3C-3H-4C-X-P-4H-5C-X-P-P-P. Niemeijer led KH after the auction 1C-1H-X-XX-3C-3H-3NT-X-4C-P-5C-X-P-P-P. So, whenever 5C was reached by whatever route, the KH was led. Is is right to criticise the collective wisdom of these Bermuda Bowl or Venice Cup experts? I thought Mr Burn's comment was right, and all the Norths forgot Burn's second rule. (I would like to know the first, but suspect it is to cash the ace of trumps against a grand before partner can revoke).

Not all of these auctions call for a trump lead. Only Travis, Bakhshi and Helness (and possibly Brock) faced an auction where dummy had shown club support, partner had shown strength, and the opponents were clearly sacrificing. I suspect that most of these would agree that it was a poor lead.

I don't know about criticising the players, and I don't think anyone has done so, but I think it's fine to discuss the merits of their actions. By doing so we improve our understanding of the game, which is what we're all here for.

[gszes]

don't know the hand but also feel a trump lead is best though I remain somewhat
skeptical that it is always "best". On this hand, where I personally would never have
found the 4h bid--im a big chicken-, I would be severly afraid that p might be
expecting umm some "stuff" on defense which I do not have. I can tell from
looking at my hand the lho does not have a running suit (though they very easily
might have AQJxxx expecting any needed finesse to work). It may be that
underleading one of my kings is the only way to set the contract. I have no
strong reason to assume that is correct here so I lean toward the trump but do
so feeling great sympathy for anyone leading one of the pointed suits.

I know I know I read that the heart K was the lead of choice but I cannot "see" a
strong case for it sorry=in my defense you should see how thick my glasses are

for what its worth if I were to underlead one of my kings I would underlead the
spade K since it would have been very difficult for lho to suppress a long spade
suit than it would have been for them to suppress a long dia suit.