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In case it matters, our 1♣ includes all 11-13 and 17-19 balanced hands.
What's double?
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How do you play this double?
#1
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Posted 2014-September-07, 09:02
In case it matters, our 1♣ includes all 11-13 and 17-19 balanced hands.
What's double?
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#2
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Posted 2014-September-07, 09:39
Penalties, very likely a balanced 17 often with 4 spades and not 4 hearts, also could be 5♣/4♠ and a 16 count
#3
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Posted 2014-September-07, 17:30
Three options come to mind -
1) 17-19 Balanced,
2) Takeout of ♠
3) Any hand with 3♥ cards that wants to compete.
I like 1).
1) 17-19 Balanced,
2) Takeout of ♠
3) Any hand with 3♥ cards that wants to compete.
I like 1).
Be the partner you want to play with.
Trust demands integrity, balance and collaboration.
District 11
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Trust demands integrity, balance and collaboration.
District 11
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#4
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Posted 2014-September-07, 17:43
SteveMoe, on 2014-September-07, 17:30, said:
Three options come to mind -
1) 17-19 Balanced,
2) Takeout of ♠
3) Any hand with 3♥ cards that wants to compete.
I like 1).
1) 17-19 Balanced,
2) Takeout of ♠
3) Any hand with 3♥ cards that wants to compete.
I like 1).
1) is kind of what I assumed first, but then I thought about it and ... isn't 3) a lot more common?
"One of the painful things about our time is that those who feel certainty are stupid, and those with any imagination and understanding are filled with doubt and indecision"
-- Bertrand Russell
-- Bertrand Russell
#5
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Posted 2014-September-07, 18:18
I mean, say East has 10 points, South has 6 and West has 8. Complicated mathematical deduction will lead to the conclusion that North does not have 17-19.
Even if everyone is subminimum or bluffing, we might have 17-19, but then we might still have 3 or 4 hearts.
Even if everyone is subminimum or bluffing, we might have 17-19, but then we might still have 3 or 4 hearts.
"One of the painful things about our time is that those who feel certainty are stupid, and those with any imagination and understanding are filled with doubt and indecision"
-- Bertrand Russell
-- Bertrand Russell
#6
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Posted 2014-September-08, 01:35
Penalty. He is on lead, he may hold the hands you guys already mentioned as well as he may have doubled with running clubs. Keep in mind most people bid 1 NT without caring much about stoppers in opener's minor. But even if he has a stopper pd may have the rest + sure entries.
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#7
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Posted 2014-September-08, 03:27
You could compromise and play it as support + extras. That would make it easier for partner to convert it when it is right.
(-: Zel :-)
#8
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Posted 2014-September-08, 05:20
1C-(P)-1H-(1NT)
Here we have in our system that DBL is support.
The given auction is undefined, but I would also assume support.
Here we have in our system that DBL is support.
The given auction is undefined, but I would also assume support.
#9
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Posted 2014-September-08, 05:36
kgr, on 2014-September-08, 05:20, said:
1C-(P)-1H-(1NT)
Here we have in our system that DBL is support.
The given auction is undefined, but I would also assume support.
Here we have in our system that DBL is support.
The given auction is undefined, but I would also assume support.
Do you have the auction 1♣ - (1♥) - X - (1NT); X in your file?
(-: Zel :-)
#10
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Posted 2014-September-08, 05:51
Zelandakh, on 2014-September-08, 05:36, said:
Do you have the auction 1♣ - (1♥) - X - (1NT); X in your file?
Only that when 4th hand over calls a natural 1NT then DBL is support. System doesn't contain anything about 2nd hand also did bid in this case. But I assume it is still support.
Note: if 1NT is 2-suiter then DBL is penalty oriented.
Edit: verified with partner. He agrees it is still support.
#11
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Posted 2014-September-11, 20:56
mgoetze, on 2014-September-07, 17:43, said:
1) is kind of what I assumed first, but then I thought about it and ... isn't 3) a lot more common?
Yep.
This auction causes 2 metas to collide - opener's double as 17 -19 and as support. Perhaps the then the default should be higher frequency occasions (support).
With no agreement I suspect 1) is "safer" - more likely to be on partner's mind and more likely to win a post mortem.
Be the partner you want to play with.
Trust demands integrity, balance and collaboration.
District 11
Unit 124
Steve Moese
Trust demands integrity, balance and collaboration.
District 11
Unit 124
Steve Moese
#12
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Posted 2014-September-12, 01:03
Zelandakh, on 2014-September-08, 05:36, said:
Do you have the auction 1♣ - (1♥) - X - (1NT); X in your file?
There is a big difference between 1♣-1♥-Dbl and 1♣-1♠-Dbl. On the first auction responder will have exactly four spades, on the second responder will have 4 or more hearts. That means that 1♣-1♠-Dbl-1NT-Dbl should be support since responder can easily have 5 or more hearts. The interesting question is what 1♣-1♥-Dbl-1NT-Dbl would mean. I would say that it is a hand that doesn't want to sell out to 2♥: close to a 3145 pattern and not ashamed of having opened.
Rik
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The most exciting phrase to hear in science, the one that heralds the new discoveries, is not “Eureka!” (I found it!), but “That’s funny…” – Isaac Asimov
The only reason God did not put "Thou shalt mind thine own business" in the Ten Commandments was that He thought that it was too obvious to need stating. - Kenberg
#13
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Posted 2014-September-12, 01:22
With 3145 I think you can pass (or bid 2cl with good clubs) and then bid 2s in the rebound. 2245 is more difficult but maybe 2d is weakish because a real reverse would have doubled. I think playing this double as t/o caters to a narrow set of hands so I prefer penalty.
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